Interview with Martha Bradley Evans, current Utah Humanities Board, 2024-, former staff member, and partner, for Utah Humanities Fiftieth Anniversary oral history project, 7 November 2024.

Martha "Marti" Bradley Evans joined the Utah Humanities in 2024. Before joining the board, at the beginning of her career she worked for the Utah Humanities Council, as their development officer. Throughout the years she has held various teaching and administrative positions.

Utah Humanities at Fifty: An Oral History Project, 1975-2025 TRANSCRIPTION COVER SHEET Interviewee(s): Others present: Martha Bradley Evans None Place of interview: Date of interview: Salt Lake City, Utah 7 November 2024 Interviewer(s): Recordist: Photographer: Kathryn MacKay Kathryn MacKay Recording equipment: Transcription equipment: Tascam DR-40X Linear PCM Recorder, with built in dual microphones. NCH Express Scribe Transcription Software with Power Player foot pedal. Transcribed by/date: Transcript proofed by/date: Susan Gross, 19 November 2024 Randy Williams, 20 November 2024; Martha Bradley Evans, 21 November 2024; Randy Williams, 22 November 2024 Brief description of interview: Dr. Martha “Marti” Bradley Evans was born in Salt Lake City, Utah, and resides there now. She is a more recent member of the board of Utah Humanities. Before joining the board, at the beginning of her career she worked for the Utah Humanities Council, as their development officer. Throughout the years she has held various teaching and administrative positions. References: KM: ME: Kathryn MacKay Martha Bradley Evans NOTE: Interjections during pauses, transitions in dialogue (such as “umm,” “so,” “you know,” “and,” etc.), and false starts and stops in conversations are not included in transcribed. Some sentences are reshaped for brevity and/or clarity and are so noted. All additions to transcript noted with brackets. TRANSCRIPTION [00:01] [Opening exchange omitted.] KM: I’m Kathryn MacKay, and I’m interviewing, as part of the 50th anniversary of the Utah Humanities. And this interview is in Salt Lake. And I wonder if you would give me your full name, and when and where you were born? ME: My name is Martha Bradley Evans, and I was born in Salt Lake City, [in] 1951. KM: And I know you have recently been appointed to the board (we were just talking about that). But you had long experience with the humanities before this. So, I wonder if you would talk about those experiences, and how you first got involved with the Utah Humanities? ME: Sure. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 1 So, my very first job [before teaching evening school and] after completing my PhD was with the Utah Humanities Council; and that was (I think it was) 1989; it was a long time ago. KM: You were working with Delmont? ME: Yeah, I got to work with Delmont, and Cynthia, and Brian Crockett. And all three of them are just the most amazing people. I was hired as a development officer, and they’d never had a development officer before. So, it was [a new challenge] and I had never done it before. I had done a lot of volunteer fundraising for KUED. I was neighbors with Charlie Gibbs, who was the station manager; and he hooked me into it. And I really loved organizing the events. That was really fun. So, I wasn’t at all afraid of that kind of stuff. But they gave me that opportunity. It was a part-time job, less than – I think it was like 15-hours a week, it wasn’t even a half-time job. But it was fun; I learned a lot. And actually, that job helped me get many of the jobs I would get later, when I applied for administrative jobs, having experience in fundraising was a real plus. [Laughs] [02:07] KM: So, this was after you got your PhD, but before your academic appointment? ME: Yes; at that time, I was teaching night school for Salt Lake Community College, and then also for BYU-Salt Lake. I did a lot of night school [laughs]. KM: As an adjunct? ME: Yeah, as an adjunct, for years. KM: [Laughs] [Railroad train horn in background] ME: I made a career [of it]; one of my careers was as an adjunct professor [laughs]. KM: And you were teaching history? ME: Yes. KM: What kind of history? Just the AI? ME: Social history, family history, community history was a big one for me. At BYU-Salt Lake, I taught a class called American Heritage, which was – I did my master’s at BYU, and I was a TA in Jim Ellen’s big American Heritage class, so I had that experience. And then I just did it in small classrooms up there. KM: How long did you work for the humanities? ME: I think it was only a year; it wasn’t any longer than that, because BYU called me, and they had someone who had said he had a nervous breakdown in the classroom – KM: Oh, dear. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 2 ME: And asked if I could start for them the next day [laughs]. KM: Oh, my gosh. ME: So, for a while, I tried to do both; but I let the Humanities Council go. KM: Yeah, yeah. So, in working in development, [were] there some aspects of that job that you would talk about? Did you organize something big, or little? Or how did your work in development matter for the Utah Humanities? ME: Well, I re-read that list of questions you sent me, and I would say that the moment that I liked the most was we did a conference (a day-long conference) on the work of C.S. Lewis. KM: Oh, that’s great. [04:06] ME: You know, it was a fundraising event, because people had to pay to get in, and we got everything donated, and that was great. But it also was a friend-building event. Lots of people like Lowell Durham, Jim Jardine – they were just C.S. Lewis junkies. KM: [Laughs] ME: Using the humanities, is this kind of common language or common ground; it made those kinds of events really fun. But I loved that one; that was really fun. We did it in the old Utah Theater space, which was perfect. KM: Wonderful. ME: Kathy Peterson from Sanpete did a beautiful poster. I wish I remembered to bring it to show you. KM: Yeah. ME: It’s very, very cool. KM: Yeah. ME: So, that was fun. And you know, fundraising (for me) has always been about friend-building. And asking for money part is nothing compared to the benefit you get from all these wonderful friends that you make. KM: Absolutely. ME: So, I’ve always faced it that way, not as a chore so much. KM: It’s a great way to do it. ME: But it was easy to do that at the Utah Humanities. The reason they created that position was actually to support Linda Newell’s project, to raise money for this writing colony in southern Utah. KM: Oh! UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 3 ME: At that time, it was called The Mesa. [Zion Canyon Mesa today.] And she had developed pretty detailed plans for what every house would have, and what it would look like. They had a contract with the city of Springville – I mean, what is that town right there, at the edge of Zions? It’s not Springville; Springdale. KM: Oh, Springdale. ME: Yeah. KM: Springville – no, Springdale. ME: Springdale [laughs]. KM: There’s too many springs. ME: There are. [Laughter] KM: Springdale. ME: You know, so a lot of it was already set up; what we needed was to raise money to build at least one of the houses, and then get the ball rolling. So, in fact, I met the people who owned this foundation [through that project]. The first time I met them was in the ask I made for funds to support the Mesa Project. And they were so lovely, and generous, and kind about it. And you know, I was a total novice, in terms of asking for money. But they became my really good friends. KM: That’s great. [06:24] ME: From that time, forward. And they supported so many of the things that I’ve done. KM: That’s an interesting project for the humanities to get involved with. ME: Um-hmm. Kind of a mismatch, actually. [Laughs] KM: How so? What do you mean? ME: Well, you know – it’s essentially running a business; and it’s a business that doesn’t make its own money. It would have to always have an influx of donations. And is that really the principal business that the Humanities Council needs to be in? Seems like – if you think about their most prominent projects this year: the ones about rural crossroads – KM: Right. ME: Throughout the state – those are having a really significant impact on the whole state, not just one part of the state, or not just one kind of person. KM: Um-hmm. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 4 ME: If you think about it, the writing colony is a wonderful kind of sentimental idea for those of us who write. We would love to do it. KM: Right. ME: But what are there? Twenty of us who would benefit by it? KM: Yeah. ME: And the one thing I think that’s so powerful about the Humanities Council is the way it seeks to serve everyone, and engage the whole state: all of the people in the state in a common conversation about humanity, and what matters, and – KM: I have a sense that has been increasingly their focus. ME: Uh-huh; Jodi is good that way. KM: Yeah. ME: Yeah. KM: But so was Cynthia, and so was Delmont. ME: Uh-huh. KM: But again, it’s been an increase that emphasis – ME: Definitely. KM: Over the years. ME: When I look at the calendar of events they do – I mean, it’s really significant. KM: Yeah. ME: And they’re everywhere. [Laughter] I mean, I keep wanting to drive to different events [laughs]. I just saw the one with Greg, down in Ephraim. KM: Right, right. ME: And I’d love to go there. I don’t think I’m up for a drive in the evening to Sanpete. [Laughs] KM: Yeah. That’s great. So, then you went to work for BYU, and then what happened? So, talk a little bit about your – I know you’re going into academia – ME: Um-hmm. KM: But you can talk about that journey, if you’d like? [08:30] UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 5 ME: [Laughs] So, I actually loved teaching at BYU. It’s a place that gives you a ton of money for travel and research. I mean, how hard it is for us to squeeze money out of our institutions [laughing] to support you as a scholar, or – KM: It’s hard. ME: It’s really hard, and it’s always kind of miniscule: you have to pony up a great deal on your own. But BYU – they’re very generous in their support for scholars and research. And the kids were – I mean, the kids at BYU are like honor students, all of them. They’re just so smart, and hardworking, and talented. So, that part of it was great. It just was a time when the owners of BYU, I guess, the Church leadership didn’t like the idea of having feminists. Boyd Packer said, “Feminists, homosexuals and intellectuals,” – KM: That’s right. ME: And you know, for me – I was working on my book about the IWY [International Women’s Year] and the ERA [Equal Rights Amendment]. So, I just had a target on my back. And two of the people they fired, they said that they fired them because they weren’t good teachers. And being a good teacher was always my principle identity, and I wanted to leave on my own terms, and with my record intact, so I resigned. Do you remember Reba Keele? KM: Oh, I do, very well. ME: So, Reba Keele was in the job that I ended up having; she was the head of undergraduate studies. KM: Yeah. ME: And she remembered, for some obscure reason, that I had written my master’s thesis on Mormon Standard Plan Architecture. Go figure. KM: Wow. ME: I mean, she’s probably the only person who knew that. [Laughter] KM: That’s great. ME: But the Dean of Architecture lost their – well, Peter [Atherton at the U of U]. KM: Yes. ME: Peter stopped teaching the intro to architecture class. So, they needed someone to fill that, but no one was willing to teach the big class (because it was this gigantic class). But I’d been teaching American heritage at BYU, which had 1,000 in each of three sections. So, that was nothing to me. [10:44] So, when he first hired me, it was to teach that class. But then, within a year, I had a visiting professor appointment, and then they changed it to a tenure-track and – UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 6 KM: That’s great, that’s great. ME: Yeah. KM: I do remember Reba so well. She was such a good person. ME: Well, can you imagine doing that for someone else? She called me up and she said, “I have some work for you.” [Laughs] KM: That’s great. ME: Well, we had interviewed her for the ERA book. KM: Ah! Okay. ME: And so, I think she just had me in her mind that way. But it was the best move for me, being at the U [University of Utah], especially at the School of Architecture. KM: Yeah. ME: Instead of the history department at the U, which is always kind of crazy [Short exchange omitted.] KM: And that’s what happened? ME: Yeah. [Laughing] It’s back when [some of the history faculty were struggling with each other], was part of that as well. KM: Yeah. Oh, dear [Dean May]; he was such a good guy too. ME: Yeah, he was my chair; he was a good guy. KM: Oh, was he? ME: Yeah. KM: Oh. Well, I worked at the American West Center, which was always on the outs with the History Department (at least while I was there). So, yeah, [the] inner-departmental squabbles are always – ME: Well, they’re kind of famous for it. KM: Yeah. ME: It wasn’t just back 40 years ago [laughs]. KM: Yeah, I know. ME: Maybe even now. Paul Reeve is a former student of mine from BYU and he’s the chair now. KM: Yeah. [12:45] ME: Every time I see him we do a kind of counseling session. [Laughter] UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 7 KM: Yeah. ME: It’s really hard on him. KM: That’s great. ME: I think. Anyway – KM: Were you involved in any other humanities programming? I’m thinking of how, for instance, I was involved on their Speaker’s Bureau. ME: Oh, yeah, a lot of that. And for me, that began probably in the mid-‘80s? Yeah. It was before any of my teaching appointments, including teaching evenings. I used to do book discussions. I did the Speaker’s Bureau [laughs], and I did those a lot. I mean, I would say every other month; it seemed like quite a lot, and it was fun. KM: It was fun. ME: I still love that sort of thing, where you’re helping people who just want to talk about ideas. KM: I agree, I agree. ME: Find some common ground. KM: Were there any that specifically stand out? I’ll give you an example of mine – ME: Uh-huh? KM: And then you can tell me some of yours. So, I was sent out to the Uinta Basin to give a speech. And I went out in a snow storm – ME: Oh, no. KM: [Laughs] And so, there were three people: the person who had invited me, and his wife, and the janitor that opened the building. ME: [Laughs] Kathryn, I can’t even tell you how many times I’ve spoken to less than five people. KM: Yeah. ME: And you know, I’ve always been interested in kind of esoteric topics. And so, at conferences where all the rooms are packed, mine will be the [laughs], “Thank you for coming.” Yeah, I did a lot of those. But for some reason, I got on the rest home circuit. And I did a lot in homes where there were primarily elderly people. KM: Um-hmm. ME: And most of whom had not read the book, but they loved having it explained to them. And the one that came into my head when you asked that question was Faulkner’s Absalom, Absalom! And that’s impossible to describe what it’s about [laughing]. And then these sweet, elderly people just want to have something to grab onto. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 8 KM: That’s great. [14:53] ME: It’s this most complex text. That you just have to map out [laughs]. KM: You’re reminding me [laughs], I went out to a Midvale rest home to discuss Mormon Country with Wallace Stegner. And somebody took him to task for demeaning what he thought was Magna. ME: Uh-huh. KM: He said, “My mother kept a clean house.” ME: [Laughs] KM: And that’s always kind of fun. ME: But they cared about it that much. KM: They do. ME: I love that. KM: They did. And we had a great discussion. ME: Yeah. KM: That’s one thing that I really like about the humanities, is that they provide those opportunities for discussions. ME: Uh-huh. KM: They were great. ME: Just as our lives, as human beings. KM: Yeah. ME: It’s so wonderful. I was thinking about that last night, and it provides a counterpoint, all this craziness, and things like politics, that just make us cynical, and bitter, and frustrated; fearful. The humanities give us hope, because you see resilience in past generations, or you know, all the things that really matter in our lives. KM: I think that’s really true. ME: Yeah, it’s the currency they’ve got [laughs]. KM: Yeah, yeah. Do you remember what your last involvement with the humanities, before you came on the board? What were you doing with the humanities before you joined the board? ME: You mean humanities as a topic area? UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 9 KM: No – ME: No? KM: Specifically, in a – ME: The Council? KM: An event that was sponsored by the Utah Humanities? ME: It’s been a really long time. I think it was when Steven Trimble received the big humanities award. And it was at Rose Wagner. I mean, it was really an event; it was wonderful. But then, you know, I got so busy in these administrative jobs, I was less involved with pretty much everything [laughs]. But I kept writing history, and reading history, and – KM: Yeah. ME: You know, that still is at the core for me. KM: Right. [16:55] ME: Yeah. KM: Right. And you retired when? ME: I retired a year ago. So, I had an administrative job; I stepped down from that in 2021. And then I had a sabbatical year. I’d never had a sabbatical [laughs], which was pretty lovely, finished a book. And then I went back and taught for honors, and I worked with the presidential interns. And then I retired, officially, after that year. And now, I’m teaching adjunct for honors. KM: Are you? ME: Yeah. KM: So, you’re still involved. ME: Still involved. I didn’t like the sabbatical year, even though it was lovely to have all this time to write, and think. But I really just like being around the kids. And I had missed it. [Laughter] And I’m doing this. KM: What is this? ME: This is the Smith Pettit Foundation; and we give donations to scholars and institutions that sponsor big lectures. We also give donations to Signature Books: that’s what keeps them going. KM: Okay, yeah. ME: Yeah. This exists for that. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 10 KM: Oh. ME: [Laughs] KM: And a law firm – isn’t this – ME: It looks like a law firm, doesn’t it? But no, it’s not a law firm. KM: Oh! ME: Uh-uh. KM: What was their – what is their money from? ME: George Smith is the donor who created this; he’s an investment person [and an author]. KM: Oh, is he? ME: He’s just very wealthy; yeah. KM: Okay. ME: He, and his wife, Camille. Camille is the one I work most closely with. KM: Great, great. Yeah, I was just at Signature Books, because of Barbara [Brown]; that’s where Utah Western’s Board meets. ME: Oh, got it. KM: Yeah. ME: It’s lovely space in there, isn’t it? KM: It is lovely space. ME: [Laughs] KM: I agree; I agree. So, you’ve now been appointed to the board, and you made mention that it was ironic that it’s been these many years before you were appointed to the board. I wonder if you would talk a little bit about that? Did you apply, or did somebody sponsor you? [19:14] ME: No, I never applied. I mean, I did this time around. I just kept waiting. No, I was on the Preservation Utah board for a really long time, and that kept me – I had four boards that I was on, and it felt like that was enough. So, I never pressed my way into the Humanities Council. So, as soon as the clearing happened, then I submitted an application. KM: Great! Preservation Utah, boy, that takes me back. ME: Yeah [laughs]. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 11 KM: I was on that board also. Years and years – ME: My daughter worked there as well. KM: That’s right! ME: Yeah. KM: Because I met her when I took a group of students – I was teaching public history – that’s right. ME: That’s fun. KM: It was. ME: You know, I never officially taught public history; but I’ve sure done a lot of public history. KM: Yeah, you have. ME: It would have been fun to talk about the projects I did and what I learned from them. KM: Yeah, yeah. ME: Because you know, people kind of poo-poo public history; but my word, the scrutiny you get when the people you’re writing about [are] still alive, it’s different. KM: [Laughs] ME: It’s a different ballgame. KM: That is so true. [Train horn blaring in background] ME: Yeah. KM: Let’s go back and talk a little bit – we’ve hinted at it, but let’s talk a little bit about the Humanities’ philosophy and – [Train horn blaring loudly] [Laughs] ME: This happens every hour. [Laughter] KM: Yes, the train. They have expanded their programming – ME: Um-hmm. KM: We talked a little bit about they got involved in Museum on Main Street a few years ago, and have been sponsoring that; and the Book Festival – they have been sponsoring that for years – ME: But they’ve evolved, right? The Book Festival is in several locations, not just in one. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 12 KM: That’s right. ME: Right, so they – KM: That’s right. ME: They’re very energized it feels like, in terms of redefining and reshaping what they do, which is great, so it’s not static. Yeah. KM: Yeah. [21:25] And both of those projects, as you’re saying, go out into rural Utah. And that matters, greatly. KM: I agree. ME: I don’t think there’s any other institution that does that. I mean, maybe official governmental entities like BLM [laughs]; they have a statewide scope. But this is pretty unique in that – KM: Yeah, I think so. ME: I think, the scope. KM: Talk a little bit about working for Delmont? ME: Oh, my; Delmont was such a dear. You know, I was below being a peon in that office because I was so new. I had not done anything like what they were doing. But they were all so lovely and gracious, and got me engaged in everything real quickly. But Delmont really took me under his wing, and he was just such a kind-hearted mentor to me for so long. You know, my mother died in 1997, and he sent me a bouquet of flowers, helium balloons, and a really sweet note that just bounced around my house. But then he died. And none of us had the heart to throw away these dead balloons [laughing]. My whole family recognized this was just going to be with us for a really long time. KM: Yeah. ME: But he just has that kind of lingering kindness that I experienced over and over again. KM: I agree. ME: Plus, he was real serious about the humanities. KM: Well, he was! ME: Yeah. KM: He was very committed. ME: [Laughs] Yeah. KM: Yeah. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 13 ME: And everything he did was infused with that kind of reverence for what the humanities represent. And it was great, because he was such a great example of someone who wasn’t doing that job just for a job. But you know, it was like a religion for him. KM: That’s really true. ME: And anyone who was around him would pick up on that and aspire to the same. KM: Yeah, I agree. ME: He was really a kind-hearted mentor. One of the big ones for me. KM: Yeah; me too. And then Cynthia came, and – ME: Well, Cynthia is just a class act. KM: Yeah. ME: You know, to her core. Everything about her represents intelligence, and justice. And you know, she’s really something. I have always felt so lucky that I got to work with her briefly; but then to have a whole lifetime of being her friend was, you know, that was the rich reward for it. KM: Yeah, yeah. ME: [Laughs] [24:00] KM: Well, I remember when she came to town and we went to the humanities events in Sun Valley, and that was quite an adventure. ME: Oh, how fun. KM: It was. ME: Yeah. KM: It really was. ME: Yeah, she’s really something; there’s no one like her. KM: Yeah, I agree. I agree. And now, Jodi is the director; and we both get to work with her a little bit. ME: Yeah. Well, and she just has such – she has such good ideas and energy. Someone like that will burn out at some point [laughing], I would think. KM: I think so; I think so. ME: But I’ve been so impressed by what I’ve seen in terms of what she does. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 14 KM: You know, the Utah Humanities has really been – what’s the word? It’s been blessed with good leadership. ME: Yeah, the entire time it’s been with us. KM: That little glitch between Delmont and Cynthia, but it righted itself. ME: Yeah. KM: And has gone forward. ME: Well, when she stepped into that role, she just really owned it, you know? KM: Yeah. ME: So, I was impressed by that. KM: Yeah. ME: Yeah. KM: I agree; I agree. Anything else about the Humanities that I haven’t asked you, that you’d like to talk about? ME: [Laughs] You know, I wonder how many people even know it exists? I mean, we’re part of this world that’s like a bubble in this larger world. I mean, I’ve been thinking so much about that since the election results came in. [laughing] I just don’t even know who all these people are. I don’t understand it. KM: Yeah. ME: But there are a lot of people I really respect who went in a way that I wouldn’t have gone, you know? So, how do the people who are making wrong choices in elections – and I’m not just saying the presidential election – but how does what Utah Humanities Council do to inform citizens, or to improve the way we engage in civic discourse? [26:03] KM: Yeah. ME: That is an area that sometimes they’re involved, and sometimes they’re not so involved in it. But in a moment like this, it seems really incredibly important. KM: Yeah. And I know the Humanities, in their push to build and support communities, is in the background when the community gets a grant. ME: Right, right. KM: And then it becomes the community’s grant – ME: And they love that about it. KM: Yeah, and they love that. But it puts the Humanities program way in the background. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 15 ME: Yeah. KM: And yeah – [laughs] ME: Well, and I bet they talk about that all the time, you know? “Should we step forward more? Should we frame it in a way where no one can forget who sponsored it?” You know [laughs], this may seem so strange to even say, but my whole career has been as a back-up singer [laughs], do you know? I have created programs, and sponsored programs, and sponsored students without needing to be up front with it. And there’s a different kind of gratification that comes with it; and it doesn’t make it any less important [laughs]. KM: That’s true. ME: And you know, that’s the situation that they’re in. KM: That’s true. Well, and who knows what’s in store for the Humanities – ME: Yeah. KM: Because as you know, in the last legislature they attempted to (at the national level) cut the humanities’ budget – ME: Right. KM: By quite a bit. And I will say that the representative in my area, Blake Moore, was the only Utah representative that didn’t vote to defund. ME: Really? KM: Yeah, yeah. ME: And how do you explain that? [Laughs] What’s influencing him? [28:02] KM: Darren Parry, I think. ME: Uh-huh, uh-huh. [Laughter] Well, and that’s important, isn’t it? KM: Yeah. ME: Yeah. KM: I think so. ME: Uh-huh. KM: I think so. But it will be interesting to see what kinds of moves the Humanities makes – ME: Right, to remain relevant. UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 16 KM: Yeah. ME: Yeah. Well, and what’s happening in universities with history departments shrinking. I mean, there’s always a conversation around eliminating certain programs that are underfunded. For example, the Provost at the U right now [Mitzi M. Montoya and] Paul Reeve is the one who told me this, but she’s asking for a really different kind of performance review. And it’s more like a return on investment scheme [laughs]. KM: Wow. ME: So, how can you justify having this very large faculty and put out only a very small group of majors. KM: Yeah. ME: I wouldn’t want to be in those roles right now [laughs]. KM: No, not at all. Anything else? ME: No. It’s awesome to sit across the table from you. KM: [Laughs] Oh, great. ME: [Laughs] KM: Well, thank you very much. ME: You’re welcome. [Recording stops and starts again] [29:07-29:34 Omitted: Recorder inadvertently started while KM and MB chatting after interview.] [End recording – 29:34] UTAH HUMANITIES AT FIFTY: MARTHA BRADLEY-EVANS 17